ChineseSavvy Forums Forum Index
Author Message

<  General Discussion  ~  anti-cnn.com and why we are angry

janepeng
Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:42 am Reply with quote
Joined: 12 Aug 2007 Posts: 255
The first class I've had at a well-known American news agency was that we report facts, and not opinions. That the first thing you should do after you get some news is confirmation. confirm, always. But in the recent bombast of western media and the "poisoned dumpling" and China's toys issues, we have seen nothing but opinion from the western media. And biased opinions, too.

When they are busy quoting Dalai Lama, they just choose to ignore the voice of 1.3 billions of Chinese people, as if we do not exist.

http://www.anti-cnn.com/

The following are some of the mistakes made by western media in reporting according to anti-cnn.com.

1. Cutting part of the pictures as the whole picture.

2. Making use of photos which are not taken in Tibet, not even in China

3. Lies

4. Calling Tibet a country.

Such collective effort to link politics with the Olympics, and at a well-chosen time, I cannot but feel very sorry for some of the media which have forgot or chosen to ignore basic disciplines in the profession.


A more objective account of the violence that broke out in Lhasa on March. 14.

Quote:
This is an eyewitness account of a foreign resident in Lhasa who took refuge in a hotel close to the centre of the Tibetan capital yesterday. The city was gripped by violence after protesters and police clashed

"Oh my God. Oh no. That's crazy. One hundred people are trying to stone one man. A man was trying to cross the street with his motorcycle - they were trying to stone him but it's so crowded I can't see whether they got him or not.

"We came out for a walk about at about five today. I knew something was happening because there were a lot of people on the street. We were on Sera Street, which goes to the [Klukang] monastery. It sounds like the noise came from there; it sounds like at first they had been fighting in the temple.

"We saw people running and people in this hotel told us to get in quickly as the crowd was coming. They seem OK here, maybe the owner is Tibetan. All the other hotels have smashed windows.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/mar/15/tibet.china2
View user's profile Send private message
Jojo
Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:07 pm Reply with quote
Site Admin Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 1100 Location: Peking
支持!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

_________________
angry young woman who supports made-in-China
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger ICQ Number
Patricia
Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 12:49 am Reply with quote
Joined: 12 Sep 2007 Posts: 59
What is Truth? As you say, there is a difference between fact and opinion, also a saying "There are three sides to every argument- my side, your side, and the truth". Reporters will find what they are looking for, whichever side they are on.
Whatever is written, no-one knows a place as well as the people who live there.

And I'm still looking forward to my trip to China, and seeing all the places I have dreamed about! (As long as the humiliating troubles of Heathrow airport have been sorted out!)

Pat XX
View user's profile Send private message
Jojo
Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 9:57 am Reply with quote
Site Admin Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 1100 Location: Peking
1. Cutting part of the pictures as the whole picture.

2. Making use of photos which are not taken in Tibet, not even in China

4. Calling Tibet a country.


that's the truth~

_________________
angry young woman who supports made-in-China
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger ICQ Number
janepeng
Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 9:33 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 12 Aug 2007 Posts: 255
What is truth... I don't know. I'm actually doubting whether or not I should take up this issue as I presume that most of the savviers here are people who love China and wouldn't have boycotted the Olympics anyway... But here is something I'd like to say...

On the way I go to work, there is a university gym where the Olympic volleyball match will be held. The site has been going through renovation since last year (or maybe earlier). Now the renovation is almost complete and I could see the grass growing on the football ground, as it is spring now.

Today, I went jogging on the playground, as was my habit. Seeing an old man flying the kite on the playground, and feeling the soft grass, it just occurred to me that I might not have been able to enjoy all this if China had not won the opportunity to host the Olympic Games.

The day before yesterday, I passed some westerner coming out of the apartment building where I live. I don't know him personally, although I have a certain impression. And he said to me in not very fluent but still clear enough Chinese, "Ni Hao". Would he learn Chinese if China were not hosting the Olympics, or would he come to China at all?

No, or maybe not exactly. People from elsewhere in the world and I would still meet, and the playground on the university campus would still be renovated, only it might have to wait until years later...

This is my point. The Olympics is not some distant future, it is happening now. And it has and will bring some very good opportunities for everyone, not just the Chinese people.

But what has it got to do with Tibet, you may ask?

No, I never thought the two were related, until cruel reality reminds me in the shape of headlines in some newspaper, same words in different languages, "Boycott the Olympic Games". ...

But what will happen will just happen. Just as China lost to Sydney by two votes but won the bid, for the 2008 Olympics. The men and women who have prepared for the Olympics risking being shot, in Iraq, in Afghanistan, they will show their courage and sports skill at the Olympics. And set some new records. And that's the truth, maybe?
View user's profile Send private message
Patricia
Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 7:15 am Reply with quote
Joined: 12 Sep 2007 Posts: 59
Jane, that was so well written, I felt I was with you, walking across the grass, worrying about how things were developing. It is such a sensitive subject that it is hard to talk about, but I understand completely your feelings.
And as for me, when you say anyone on this site must love China you are right again. I have had a fascination and love of China for a long time.
Oh, there is so much I could write!

Just think - in another life you could have been English! We are horrible, and everybody hates us!!
Pat XX
View user's profile Send private message
Patricia
Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:44 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 12 Sep 2007 Posts: 59
I forget that something written down does not always sound as it was intended. My last remark was meant to make you laugh!
View user's profile Send private message
marlene
Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:56 pm Reply with quote
Moderator Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 1022
Patricia wrote:
I forget that something written down does not always sound as it was intended. My last remark was meant to make you laugh!


Don't worry.

"Just think - in another life you could have been English! We are horrible, and everybody hates us!! "

That's so not true. I'm sure a lot of nations in the world admire the English. Just like you having a fascination of China for a long time, i as an English major, and maybe Jane as well, have been preconditioned to like many, if not everything that is English...
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
DrMMHMD
Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:16 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 84
janepeng wrote:
The first class I've had at a well-known American news agency was that we report facts, and not opinions. That the first thing you should do after you get some news is confirmation. confirm, always. But in the recent bombast of western media and the "poisoned dumpling" and China's toys issues, we have seen nothing but opinion from the western media. And biased opinions, too.

When they are busy quoting Dalai Lama, they just choose to ignore the voice of 1.3 billions of Chinese people, as if we do not exist.

http://www.anti-cnn.com/

The following are some of the mistakes made by western media in reporting according to anti-cnn.com.

1. Cutting part of the pictures as the whole picture.

2. Making use of photos which are not taken in Tibet, not even in China

3. Lies

4. Calling Tibet a country.

Such collective effort to link politics with the Olympics, and at a well-chosen time, I cannot but feel very sorry for some of the media which have forgot or chosen to ignore basic disciplines in the profession.


A more objective account of the violence that broke out in Lhasa on March. 14.

Quote:
This is an eyewitness account of a foreign resident in Lhasa who took refuge in a hotel close to the centre of the Tibetan capital yesterday. The city was gripped by violence after protesters and police clashed

"Oh my God. Oh no. That's crazy. One hundred people are trying to stone one man. A man was trying to cross the street with his motorcycle - they were trying to stone him but it's so crowded I can't see whether they got him or not.

"We came out for a walk about at about five today. I knew something was happening because there were a lot of people on the street. We were on Sera Street, which goes to the [Klukang] monastery. It sounds like the noise came from there; it sounds like at first they had been fighting in the temple.

"We saw people running and people in this hotel told us to get in quickly as the crowd was coming. They seem OK here, maybe the owner is Tibetan. All the other hotels have smashed windows.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/mar/15/tibet.china2



I live in and love China. However, your country is one big deception. Whether it is the air, water, soil , food , economy or politics, the whole country is toxic.

The IOC gave the olympics to China so that the eyes of the world would turn to China to see the horrible human rights issues. Along with environmental, economic and political injustices. This will not be China's year to join the modern world but it will be the beginning of the undoing of China. The economy of China is a huge deception. 800 million people live in 900,000 farm villages with no reliable running water, variable electricity, no septic or sewage disposal. You do not have a national health care policy, social benifits for the sick or aged. Your schools are an embarassment with broken windows, pails for toilets, no heat and the students must bring their own chairs, yet you host the olympics and send ships into space. Students can buy degrees and arrive in other countries with false credentials. ( I know three in Canada).

China admits to 250,000 deaths a year from toxic ground water.
Last year you had 176,000 reported work related deaths.
Your country admits to 3,200 exectuions each year, more than all the rest of the world put togther.

It is estimated that 500,000 people die from road accidents.

I am a medical doctor, I work in the "world famous" huaxi hospital. They have the worlds biggest liver transplant program, all from executed prisoners.

What china does not realize is that they are being set up to be economically destroyed this year. The top finanical advisors are telling investors to pull their money out of asian markets and investments before the olympics. The upcoming american election is a huge problem for china. eventually as the race gets tighter, one party will look to trade tax china to try and save american manufacturing.

I was at the olympic site 3 weeks ago and it is about 2 years away from being completed. The neighbourhood is a wreck and new buildings are already falling apart.

No civilized country shots its own people or allows such to happen. Western doctors working in tibet have reported 100's of deaths. china says 13

i worked in changsha during the winter storm, thousands froze to death, china says 400.
the hospitals had no supplies, the doctors are corrupt, many died needlessly

you, are indoctrinated by the communist political spin doctors. you actually believe that tibet belows to china. chinese people believe what they are taught and told.

this year begins the "correction" of china, all brought on by an over ambitious china. everyone in china is in a pathetic race to grab as much as they can.

china is doomed, 658 new coal burning power plants are being built in the next 4 years
they are burying their best agricultural land under water for power electric dams.
the background public health is disgraceful and unnecessary, kids shitting on the sidewalks, people spitting everywhere, merchants throwing their garbage on the streets in front of their business

china is frantically making deals with every poor county in africa nd south america in a desparate bid for agricultural land and resources.

This year the bank system of china will collapse, 100's of millions who have left their family farm land for the city life will return to the country. all your country needs is a draught (has) , unemployment, (soon) and political unrest and their will be a peoples revolution, just like the last one 60 years ago, and for the same reasons, greed and corruption.
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Jack Fancy
Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:25 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 17 Jan 2008 Posts: 80
I agree with your facts but not with all of your intimations...
It is tragic how there seems to be little regulation of spoiling the Earth...Anywhere...

In the city I live in alone, just fifteen years ago they were still using food coupons...
I've seen farmers who still don't know how to use the toilet on the train...
Educating them all so quickly, about everything that "we" consider "civilized"...?
Good luck...

You talk about violence, road kills, social security and bad health care...
In comparison to whom...? Cuba..? America..? Norway..?
I just did a quick google about road deaths in America...43,000 last year...
I know about health care there...
I stopped at that point 'cause I'm tired...

Corruption...? sure, it's thicker in China than maybe other places...
But it's hard to paint it black and white when considering Chinese Guan Xi...

The beautiful thing about Chinese culture is not only what they have pioneered but how adapting they can be... They've been through a lot, they'll go through a lot more...
The fact that they've been through so much means they'll be able to withstand this "economic destruction"...

You underestimate Chinese and overestimate some facts...

...And which country of people do not believe what they are told..?
Or are so apathetic they don't care...?
Or are spun so hard they don't know which way is up..?

Like I said, I agree with some of your points, I just think you're being overly dramatic...
And yes, I still roll my eyes when I see a kid sh*t on the sidewalk...
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Opal
Posted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:30 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 08 Nov 2006 Posts: 799
DrMMHMD wrote:

This year the bank system of china will collapse, 100's of millions who have left their family farm land for the city life will return to the country. all your country needs is a draught (has) , unemployment, (soon) and political unrest and their will be a peoples revolution, just like the last one 60 years ago, and for the same reasons, greed and corruption.


In that case i suggest that you should just leave, period.
View user's profile Send private message
DrMMHMD
Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:04 am Reply with quote
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 84
Opal wrote:
DrMMHMD wrote:

This year the bank system of china will collapse, 100's of millions who have left their family farm land for the city life will return to the country. all your country needs is a draught (has) , unemployment, (soon) and political unrest and their will be a peoples revolution, just like the last one 60 years ago, and for the same reasons, greed and corruption.


In that case i suggest that you should just leave, period.


I work in China as your country does not provide medical care to your people. I work in your country because your government is sending rockets into space and your corrupt greedy doctors will not do their job if they do not get a red envelope for several times their monthly pay. Even though you can get a ilver transplant, heart transplant, kidney transplant, hours away in cities of a million you cannot get the most rudimentary medical care or routine consumable supplies.

I worked in Hunan during the recent snow storm. All your national TV did not show the sh*t hole dirty hospitals and stacks of people piled in the snow frozen to death. It did not show the coal buring stoves in the hospital heating water to thaw frozen extremities. It did not show the hospital toilets heaped with sh*t and the washrooms with no sinks, soap or water. It did not show the hospital emplyees all chatting on QQ while thousands suffered wating for care.

however, I am sure you have seen the great patriotic stage productions in the last month showing the heroic military shovelling the snow and fixing everything.

China is communist, perhaps you should read the "Marxist Manifesto" which details how all men are to get a fair and opportune share of a countries wealth.


Almost all HIV/AIDS programs in your country are funded my first world nations.

Almost all TB treatment programs are funded by first world nations.

You have the highest rates of gastric and gynecologic cancers in the world and not one study has been done by your country to determine why.

I routinely do skin grafts on patients who have been intentionally burnt with boiling oil by your government and police.

40% of your ground water is seriously contaminated with pesticides which are sold unregulated

You executed your minister of food and drug safety to impress the world that your country is serious about the quality of food and drug exports. The world was not impressed.

China simply has no idea how to behave under the scrutiny of the entire world.
China's biggest problem is its inability to be honest with its populace.

I have never worked in a country in which i have sense such a massive nightmare coming.
thankfully, when the time comes, i have an option to leave
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Opal
Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:05 am Reply with quote
Joined: 08 Nov 2006 Posts: 799
[quote="DrMMHMD"][quote="Opal"]
DrMMHMD wrote:

I work in China as your country does not provide medical care to your people. I work in your country because your government is sending rockets into space and your corrupt greedy doctors will not do their job if they do not get a red envelope for several times their monthly pay. Even though you can get a ilver transplant, heart transplant, kidney transplant, hours away in cities of a million you cannot get the most rudimentary medical care or routine consumable supplies.

I worked in Hunan during the recent snow storm. All your national TV did not show the sh*t hole dirty hospitals and stacks of people piled in the snow frozen to death. It did not show the coal buring stoves in the hospital heating water to thaw frozen extremities. It did not show the hospital toilets heaped with sh*t and the washrooms with no sinks, soap or water. It did not show the hospital emplyees all chatting on QQ while thousands suffered wating for care.

however, I am sure you have seen the great patriotic stage productions in the last month showing the heroic military shovelling the snow and fixing everything.

China is communist, perhaps you should read the "Marxist Manifesto" which details how all men are to get a fair and opportune share of a countries wealth.


Almost all HIV/AIDS programs in your country are funded my first world nations.

Almost all TB treatment programs are funded by first world nations.

You have the highest rates of gastric and gynecologic cancers in the world and not one study has been done by your country to determine why.

I routinely do skin grafts on patients who have been intentionally burnt with boiling oil by your government and police.

40% of your ground water is seriously contaminated with pesticides which are sold unregulated

You executed your minister of food and drug safety to impress the world that your country is serious about the quality of food and drug exports. The world was not impressed.

China simply has no idea how to behave under the scrutiny of the entire world.
China's biggest problem is its inability to be honest with its populace.

I have never worked in a country in which i have sense such a massive nightmare coming.
thankfully, when the time comes, i have an option to leave


Well, thanks, if you have done some good work as you said, and not just checked out every KTV for prostitution or seduced cute waitresses on the train whenever you can. Who is paying you to work here, some first world nations for their philanthropic programs i suppose?

I don't see much television or read news and don't collect figures on how much progress China has made. So, i will only speak from personal experience.

I am from countryside and i returned to countryside in the snowstorm during the Chinese New Year. I still sometimes see kids sh*t on sidewalk, people spit on the streets, like i must have seen those when i was a kid. But i don't resent those as much as you did, even after i have travelled and lived in your first world nations for years, because i understand, and remember where i come from, and believe things would change, thankfully never exactly as someone civilised western style might wish. I'm optimistic, not because of anything in the media, but because i for one and so many around me are working hard for some good causes, maybe not HIV/AIDS programs or direct enviromental protection, but we are doing our bit.

I'm sorry that you see so much misery and evil in China, in its government, populace, enviroment, economy, everything. There is some truth in what you said about all that. But could it also reflect something about yourself, Doctor? Maybe you have stayed here too long.

Btw, i thought it was the US that was seeing an economic recession?
View user's profile Send private message
Jack Fancy
Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:32 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 17 Jan 2008 Posts: 80
Where ever you are from Mr. Mad Doctor, I'm sure your country has done no wrong...

If China has the highest rate of gastric and colon cancer in the world yet the government has never done a study on it then how are you getting your facts..?
You've been to a lot of countries and haven't been in China for very long which means you can't speak the language which means, like everything else you've read, you're being spoon fed...

Do I doubt the sh*t that you see...? No. This is a big country that has made more progress in thirty years than any other country in history. Sure, they've trampled on the environment and human rights to get there and that can be upsetting, as it is in other countries as well...

...and, if the Chinese government is pouring boiling oil on innocent victims, then I'm sure the last thing they are going to do is let them free to roam a public hospital. You not speaking Chinese probably were told this as fact.

Anyways, like Opal, I can't even feel but a fraction of what you're talking about...
I think the nightmare is coming tomorrow... Nice time to leave, yeah?
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
DrMMHMD
Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:34 pm Reply with quote
Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 84
Jack Fancy wrote:
Where ever you are from Mr. Mad Doctor, I'm sure your country has done no wrong...

If China has the highest rate of gastric and colon cancer in the world yet the government has never done a study on it then how are you getting your facts..?
You've been to a lot of countries and haven't been in China for very long which means you can't speak the language which means, like everything else you've read, you're being spoon fed...

Do I doubt the sh*t that you see...? No. This is a big country that has made more progress in thirty years than any other country in history. Sure, they've trampled on the environment and human rights to get there and that can be upsetting, as it is in other countries as well...

...and, if the Chinese government is pouring boiling oil on innocent victims, then I'm sure the last thing they are going to do is let them free to roam a public hospital. You not

speaking Chinese probably were told this as fact.

Anyways, like Opal, I can't even feel but a fraction of what you're talking about...
I think the nightmare is coming tomorrow... Nice time to leave, yeah?



1) Costa Rica actually has the highest documented incidence and prevalence of gastric cancer. The international medical community feels that China's is the highest. This is reported at international surgical conferences. The Chinese will not release statistics on this. governement In Canada I do about 3 gastric resections a year as a general surgeon.

2) I don't know how you have deterrmined how long I have been in China but I have
worked as a medical doctor in Baoding, Guangzhou, Hunan, Guizhou and Chengdu.

3) I am functionally fluent in Hanzi/Hanyu. I have written 2 books published in Hanzi and have submitted two more for publishing.

4) Your assumption that I cannnot use the language is based on your own limitations and your own personal struggle, not mine.

5) Progress, show me where they have made progress. The air, water, and food supply is toxic.800,000,000 do not have reliable water, electricity, heat in their home, public health, vaccines, dental care, medical care, toilets.

6) In the summer of 2006 I worked at the 16th International Aids Conference in Toronto. I meet many doctors from China. All of them are reporting increased malignancies. An intuitive sense of the surgeons on the front line who have worked for decades is reliable. It is they that are debulking the tumours. In Guizhou province I say more gynecologic malignancies in one year than I have in 21 years in Canada, in a city of 350,000.

7) Hospitals collect statistics. These are readily available. This allows inference on incidence and prevalence rates within geographic areas. China does not have the resources to do a nationwide database. They are still struggling to build schools in many areas.

Cool you quote Opal, Chinese people are grossly ignorant of what goes on in their country. What they know is what they were taught in public school, middle school and reinforced on the radio, televison and newspaper. I do not really know if the english fluent Chinese are too ashamed to admit what their county is or just are truly ignorant. I have had many Chinese deny vehemenently that Chinese people do not know how to use a toilet on a train. But upon inquiry, they have never taken a long train ride or used the toilets.This is typical of Chinese awareness. China is all about denial. They appear on the street and at work all nicely dressed and they point out the laces on my shoes and the spots on my pants, and the repairs on my coat and when I go tho their apartment they live like dirty pigs. There is food on the floor, the kitchen table is filthy.

9)"Anyways, like Opal, I can't even feel but a fraction of what you're talking about... "

Do you know the real China? Or are you another "english teacher" with fake credentials living in a protected environment supported by Chinese people sheilding you from the real China. Beijing, Shanghai, Qingdao, this is not the real China. This is a gross misrepresentation of the other 95% of China. have you explored the entire city where you live or just the safe areas with buses and lights? I was recently in ShiJiaZhuang, the capital of Hebei, at the train station the people stood around me like a heard of cows just staring at me. I expect this in Guizhou province but not the capital of Hebei.

Have you travelled China, has Opal, I have not yet meet a Chinese person that has seen any where near as much of China as I have. Perhaps your impression of China is from your maladaptive expatriot friends who cloister in their dysfunctional expatriot community and drink and smoke hash to protect themselves from the reality. Most expatriots that I have meet could not get a job in their own country.But in China they are "foreign expert". Do you have a fake diploma from the Phillipines?


You are confusing observation with criticism, as i stated , i love China, I am just telling you what I have observed.
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger

Display posts from previous:  

All times are GMT + 8 Hours
Page 1 of 7
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next
Post new topic

Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum